NFTs for climate awareness – Green panel

NFTs for climate awareness - Green panel-Amanda Fetter-Maya Frost-Adrian Dellecker

Participants:

• Nadja Bester (CEO & Co-founder of AdLunam)

• Amanda Fetter (Program & Community Manager at Voice)

• Maya Frost (Artist & Activist supporting climate solutions)

• Adrian Dellecker (Co-founder tldr.earth)

00:22

Nadja

Hey, web3 world. This is Nadja Bester from AdLunam and you are listening to the Future of NFTs, the show that looks beyond current NFT use cases and dives into what Non Fungible Token technology is evolving into. All this as seen through the eyes and built by the minds of the fascinating guest speakers that we speak to each week. AdLunam is the only IDO Launchpad that rewards attention with allocation. Our Engage to Earn platform features dynamic NFT investor profiles, NFT allocation fractionalization and our one of a kind Proof of Attention allocation mechanism. If you are joining us here for the first time, you can catch Future of NFTs live on Twitter Spaces every Tuesday and also subscribe to us on your favorite podcast streaming platform as well as for our sister show Diving into Crypto, which is live every Thursday. So same time, same place. Join us for both shows as we speak through thought leaders and change makers in this game changing industry onto today.

01:36

Nadja

I really debated with myself how to start today's intro. I could tell you warning the last decade was the hottest on 125,000 years. CO2 is at its highest in 2 million years. We are losing 1.2 trillion tons of ice each year, which is equivalent to all human made things and all living things on the planet. I could say that billions of people within the next hundred years are going to become climate refugees because some places on the earth will simply be too hot to live. I could use any of these fear tactics. We are all so intimately familiar with how the media portrays the future of the environment and really acts on those emotions. Unfortunately to the extent that many people now suffer from climate change fatigue and apocalypse fatigue. So I am very excited for our topic today because rather than try and use the scary facts tactic, we are talking about a solution from a left side left field position.

02:56

Nadja

Web3 is not typically something in all of the sexy hype about the latest, greatest technology and projects that we focus on in terms of the environment. But my guest speakers today, my guests today are really going to delve into this idea that what Web3 has to offer is something that perhaps no other industry, and especially not the traditional environmental focused industry, is able to offer solutions. So very excited. What is the potential of Web3 to evolve this narrative around climate change and especially today's topic climate awareness? So I'm going to give you an introduction at a brief, high level version of today's amazing guests. Very complex topic, no easy answers. So we have experts in the house who really can help us look at these situations that we are facing, both as individuals as well as a society from the NFT and Web3 perspective.

04:08

Nadja

So first we have Maya Frost, an NFT artist and an activist supporting climate solutions. Maya is an artist, author, activist, and a solar punk transitioner storyteller. So you can just tell that whatever she does is at the same time not only important, but also really cool. So Maya has a very innovative approach to NFTs that goes, in fact, beyond just today's topic, but we'll have to get her back on the show in future to talk about some of those other projects she's working on. So Maya has this focus in her NFT art on NFTs for good, and this has led to many environmentally focused and environmentally inspired collections. So looking forward, Maya, to getting into this topic with you today. Thank you so much and welcome on the show.

05:03

Maya

Thank you, I'm very happy to be here. There is so much to talk about, and I am very happy that we have this opportunity to talk about all the positive things that are happening in terms of climate awareness and climate solution.

05:16

Nadja

Absolutely, yes. The positive aspects. Love that. Next, we have Adrian Dellecker, who is the co-founder of tldr.earth or Too Long Don't Read Earth. He has been in the conservation space for years and have a couple of years ago, started transitioning into Web3 solutions related to his domain expertise. Before co-founding tldr.earth, an organization that promotes Web3 solutions for nature, Adrian was the head of Global Policy and Advocacy at WWF International, the World Wildlife Fund, as well as the former head of Program strategy and development at the Luke Hoffman Institute, which is an independent research hub dedicated to biodiversity solutions and innovations. And last but for sure, not least, we have Amanda Fetter. Amanda, am I pronouncing your name correctly?

06:19

Amanda

Yeah, it's Fetter.

06:21

Nadja

Okay, thank you. So Amanda is the program and community manager at Voice, a leading carbon neutral NFT marketplace. Amanda is going to offer her perspectives as an advocate for diversity and inclusion in art spaces, as well as using blockchain for a greener future. Amanda formerly was the manager of a contemporary art gallery for a number of years, so she now extends her passion for working directly with artists at Voice, where she nurtures and guides artists in the Voice residency programs, which often has an environmentally slated theme. So, Adrian and Amanda, thank you both so much. It's amazing to have on such a diverse perspective of this topic, and I feel absolutely honored to have the three of you on today. Adrian, where are you dialing in from today?

07:21

Adrian

Hi, thanks for having me. I'm dialing from my home in Switzerland, Europe, so I really look forward to this discussion.

07:29

Nadja

So were debating earlier because I'm also in Europe. So I was saying we have Maya in South America, Amanda in North America, myself in Europe. So you have to be in either Africa or Asia to at least make this a very well rounded discussion, but unfortunately, not today. Amanda, welcome. So, so great to have you with us. I'm going to start with you. Please tell us more about you, how you got into NFTs and also leading up to any specific NFT focused areas or projects that you are currently working on.

08:04

Amanda

09:07

Amanda

So many artists, even gallery represented ones, have to work multiple jobs to survive and pay their bills. And once an artwork sells, it's out of their hands forever. So the starving artist trope exists for a reason. So the main factor that got me involved with NFTs to begin with was the possibility for creating a more sustainable financial model for artists. And then I saw a job opening at Voice and I kind of jumped at the opportunity to be a part of this, primarily because I loved that they're creator first platform that really centers artists. But another really significant factor for me was that they're carbon neutral. And this job allows me to continue to be in daily direct contact with artists all over the world, while also not compromising on my passion for eco sustainability. And I don't ever want to be a part of a company that is negatively impacting the environment.

10:10

Amanda

So that's kind of what got me into NFTs and how I got into Voice. And then currently, I am working with artists directly every day from all over the world and onboarding them into web3 and Blockchain and NFTs in a way that is climate and eco conscious.

10:36

Nadja

Amanda, thank you so much for that amazing introduction. Maya would love to move on to you. I know that you're an artist yourself and so would really love to hear how did you get into NFTs and really, where are you taking this? I know a little bit about what you are doing, so hence saying earlier that we definitely have to get you on the show and a future episode as well. Just to talk about NFTs in general, but would love to hear just a little bit about the climate, environmentally focused NFT collections that you are also working with at the moment.

11:14

Maya

Sure. Well, it really kind of started for me during the pandemic because I spent the lockdown, which was very strict and long here in Argentina in a studio apartment with my husband and kind of switched my art making from painting to digital art just because I was in a confined space and I didn't want to take over the whole space with chemical fumes and all of that and completely switched over to making digital art. And once I started doing that, I really realized the freedom of it. And in some ways I liked the limitation of it. I felt like it was liberating in a way. And then along came NFTs. Last fall was when I first started learning about them and I immediately understood the potential for an artist who has art to share but is worried about environmental impact, whether that's the paint and the canvas or the shipping, the transport of the goods to collectors.

12:18

Maya

And it just really made so much sense to me and I was excited to see sort of a flattening of the field and that access to anyone anywhere, to sell art to anyone else anywhere else. And that's really where my interest started. But all the way through, from the very first time I started reading about NFTs, I think the first article I read was about the environmental impact of Ethereum and Bitcoin and proof of work. So from the very beginning I was concerned about how to do it in a way that not only didn't harm the environment, but that actually contributed in some positive way to a climate solution, an organization, storytelling that would help people understand what's really happening. And so it was just sort of a natural direction for me to go with NFT art, storytelling and climate.

13:16

Nadja

Maya, thank you so much. I love this highlighting of A, the freedom, but also the limitation of digital art, but then also, as you say, that physical art also has an environmental impact. So I think those are some really important points to highlight. Adrian, I first got introduced to your work when you were still with the Luke Hoffman Institute and I think you did a panel discussion on gamification and conservation. And this was when I was working with a Web3 company focused on impact investing. And so I loved listening to your discussion at the time and really at focusing on how to think differently about the work, the very important work that is being done in the environmentally focused space. But the fact that it needs to shift from the current models and the traditional and existing models, really, to something that just moves with the time in the sense that it stays connected to that pulse of the logic culture.

14:26

Nadja

So I would love to hear your journey. How did you end up getting into NFTs, into the metaverse, from the perspective of any of these solutions might help to contribute to this narrative of conservation and environmental protection? Yeah, take it away.

14:48

Adrian

15:55

Adrian

And so how could you flip that over? And Blockchain appeared. And this is sort of at the height of the ICO bubble, but as a great way not just to raise funds, but to really recreate the link between those who are investing in companies and the companies themselves. And little by little. So there's that aspect of governance, engagement, fundraising. And when we did the Gamification project, there was this whole other aspect. And when I first discovered NFTs, it kind of rocked my world because in the conservation sector and when I joined WWF, we keep on saying how much these things are worth. We call them ecosystem services. These forests, these rivers, these oceans, these great whales. There's a lot of economists who struggle and they've got these amazing spreadsheets and they say, well, this whale is worth 2 million because of all the ecosystem services it provides, et cetera.

16:53

Adrian

But it's never really broken through, if you will. And NFTs just I noticed that there were a lot of people who, out of the kindness of their heart on their spare time, et cetera, were doing impact NFTs some outside of conservation, a lot for conservation. And there was an appeal to that. People were actually buying them and transacting. And I really don't think that these particular NFTs were speculative. People were really funding something. So there was a missing piece of the puzzle that suddenly came into play, which is people could directly transact and show their support and purchase something, a digital asset that would kind of reflect their personality, their drive, who they are in the digital space, and support conservation organizations or local charities. So that's where I really kind of bit hard and yeah, so much so that I eventually left the Lucas Institute to found tldr.earth.

17:58

Nadja

Thank you so much. I think, again, you're just highlighting that NFT is not only for this one audience segment, which are people who buy it based for well, based on the premise that speculative decision making is going to lead to these massive gains. But NFT is really the utility and the use case around it extends so much further than just what we are seeing in terms of PFPs and some digital art. So I want to kick off today's topic by making sure we are all on the same page with regards to what can be a very complex and also rather loaded topic. In a nutshell, I'd like each of you to just give a one liner about what is climate awareness and why is it important? Amanda, can we start with you?

18:49

Amanda

Yeah. So climate awareness to me is one thing, right? You have to understand the risks associated with climate change, but a really important part of that's not spoken about enough is climate action. What can we do? We're aware of all of the negative impacts of climate change and we're even fatigued by it, like you mentioned earlier. But what can we do? And not on an individual level, so much. There's only so much that each of us as individuals can do by recycling and minimizing our own personal impact. What needs to happen are these massive companies that are kind of like driving climate change. Those are the people that need to make these top level changes to better the world and we need to, as individuals, push them to do that and inspire that change.

19:56

Nadja

Perfect. Thank you. Adrian, what about you? What is climate awareness and why is it important?

20:05

Adrian

I would first of all, echo what Amanda said. Climate awareness is the first step. You can't really have climate action without awareness, so it's absolutely necessary, but it's not sufficient. And awareness, as you mentioned in your introduction, can also lead to kind of this apocalyptic fear of things being beyond our own control. Like, yeah, I might recycle, I might close the top when I brush my teeth, but that's not going to make a difference and there's a risk of sort of disillusionment. So awareness is the first step, it's necessary, but there's a really important second step, which, yes, is around action, as Amanda said, but it's really about empowerment. And again, to go back to NFTs, I think that's where blockchain in general, and NFTs maybe in particular, are a really interesting tool because suddenly they put the consumer more in an empowered position. And so it's one thing to say, well, companies need to change, and obviously I echo that, but they'll change if the consumers press.

21:07

Adrian

So climate action, but how do we make that leap? That's what's really important.

21:16

Nadja

Thank you so much. Maya, what, in your opinion, is climate awareness and why is it so important?

21:25

Maya

Well, first of all, I love what Amanda and Adrian had to say. I think their points are very important. But the other one is really that in my mind, climate awareness is the understanding that climate change and its impacts are the defining cause for our time. And it's not just affecting a particular generation, it's affecting people of all ages, ultimately. And that in many ways, it's such a profoundly global effort and understanding that we all need to understand and embrace. And one of the things I think that people don't quite understand about climate awareness is that in order for all of us to somehow overcome our climate anxiety and turn it into a source of energy, we need to recognize that there are small changes that we can make. Not in our own lives, particularly, for example, not just the recycling, like Amanda mentioned, but things that we can do by using our voice, because collective voices have power.

22:29

Maya

And we can join the rising tide of voices about climate change and climate action. And that's part of where the every man kind of power lies and that recognition that we have a say is critically important.

22:50

Nadja

Thank you so much, all three of you, for that amazingly beautiful introduction. I think no Google introduction, if you had to put the search term into the engine, would give you as high a quality answer. So, Maya, I'm going to ask you as someone who uses this exciting world of NFTs as a vehicle to highlight the very scary and as you mentioned, the climate anxiety that so many of us are facing as well. As this controversial topic of climate change, where we have some people saying it's not real, it doesn't exist, or it's not human caused or related at all. So we have all of these different sort of voices coming at it from all different sides. But how, in your opinion and also in what you are doing in your work, do you think that Web3 technologies, and specifically NFTs, can contribute to climate awareness in a way that perhaps other technologies, other approaches, other techniques or methods could not?

23:53

Maya

Well, I'm glad you brought up the fact that people are coming at this from very different backgrounds and with very different ideas, but I think the one thing we can all agree on is the beauty of the planet, right? So in my art and storytelling, I try to focus on that, and that's where the common ground is. What is it that we're trying to protect? Because we end up protecting what we love? And so in a lot of cases, I feel like my work is about regenerating that deep love for nature that we all have but we sometimes forget, and that's what's necessary in order to make it a priority. In terms of Web3, I really think that what's happening is there's a major shift right now, and the idea of NFTs as little square pictures that you buy is shifting. And that's a good thing because we need people to understand that NFTs are much bigger than that.

24:47

Maya

And their use is so far beyond just having and holding their use. Their utility is in contributing everything from verification of data to giving people an opportunity to feel a sense of guardianship of rainforest, for example, to protect animals, to recognize how much carbon removal is really happening, how much pollution cleanup is really happening, how much carbon sequestration is going on. Once we have data, we have power. And that's really the force of NFTs, because when we're talking about NFT, in that sense, it's the digital contract, right? It's the data, and that's what's powerful, not the little squares. As much as I love the digital art, that is not the NFTs that are going to change everything for the climate. It's really the data.

25:46

Nadja

Yeah. What important highlights in your answer in the sense that there has been so much happening on the art front. But at the same time, it's not to say that this technology is only about that, because the popular narrative in the media only focuses on, oh, wow, this painting was sold for $69 million. Of course, this is the chatter that most people focus on, but there are so many amazing use cases, many of which we haven't even discovered as yet. But really, we are in this fortunate position of being able to really experiment with and test the boundaries. Hence so cool that we are able to even use NFTs and think about something as heavy but as important as climate change. So, Adrian, we have all heard the arguments against cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin criticized for high energy use. Maya said earlier that this was one of the first things she read about when she first started exploring this industry.

26:49

Nadja

So I'm wondering, as an environmental professional who's really dedicated your career to the preservation of the natural world, do you think that using Web3 technologies for environmental protection and sustainability is a justifiable solution despite what we are? Hearing from again, many different type of voices speaking out for, speaking out against, but not necessarily always taking into account the potential versus the potential costs that we are giving in terms of energy usage, et cetera.

27:28

Adrian

Yeah, I mean, that was a very difficult debate to question in the environmental sector until recently, and I'll get back to that in a second. But Bitcoin relies on proof of work, and that is extremely energy intensive. It's about the size of Argentina. That's what they say. I mean, that's what the data says. It fluctuates, but that's about the size. But of course, I think that's probably a little bit misleading, first of all, because there's mining in Argentina, so you'd have to compare it to an industry like air conditioning or things like that provide a service. And then, of course, if you really look at the debate in great detail, it's much more nuanced because bitcoin or proof of work, mining rigs are mobile. They can capture energy where other industries cannot capture energy. They can capture the energy wasted by hydro dams or renewables when there's too much.

28:24

Adrian

So there are arguments to be said that actually bitcoin and proof of work can help the grid become more capable of handling renewable energy. That being said, web3 doesn't rely on bitcoin. I mean, as much as bitcoin is terrific, web3, everything that we sort of imply by web3, the data that Maya just talked about, the NFTs, the tokens, they're all running on new generation chains, and of course, ethereum being the more popular, has recently switched from proof of work to proof of stake. And that, I must say, on a personal level, that's been kind of a relief because as amazing as ethereum was, if you're an environmentalist, yes, that would bring there would be tradeoffs. You'd have to kind of defend the notion that it would beneficial even though it's spending a lot of energy, et cetera. I think it's a winnable debate, but it's a hard one.

29:22

Adrian

You'd really rather be on the side of proof of stake and now ethereum, and then there's a whole bunch of other new blockchains that consume absolutely negligible amounts of energy, definitely not more than other technologies. I think. It's no longer a real debate. I think, however, there are still a lot of people who think that way, and so there's still a lot of education. I mean, that's true of everything in blockchain. There's a lot of education on a number of things and on the environmental aspect as well. Lastly, this is sort of one of my things that I keep on ranting on about, but even in defense of bitcoin, I'm personally kind of annoyed by these things because our whole civilization, our whole economy, our whole well-being, our whole wealth is predicated on energy usage. And that's the whole thing. If we have a currency which is backed by energy, like bitcoin or like petrodollars, well, that actually kind of makes sense.

30:24

Adrian

It's easy to point the finger. What we really need to be doing is transitioning to a renewable future. And if bitcoin helps people focus minds and helps sort of transition, then I think that's a really good thing. So if we're really talking about NFTs now and wallets and metaverse, et cetera, it's no longer an energy question. Really.

30:54

Maya

Brilliant.

30:55

Nadja

Thank you so much, Adrian and Maya. Amanda, in terms of the web3 world, I mean, so much has been focused on these quick gains and the hyped and make it rich quick. And I mean, this is the same narrative that we have every time that there's a new development in web3, whether it is XYZ, but every time everyone's going to go to the top and when lambo. And that's kind of the conversation, at least that is the perception that many people have because the voices that speak the loudest are the ones who focus on these sort of things. And this is really how so many projects on board communities is not necessarily because those community members understand what the company is doing, but rather they are just following this hype cycle and all of the rewards that come with it. So I'm wondering if were to look at this one group of people native to Web3 and people who are very familiar with what is happening in the NFT world and the speculative investors.

32:05

Nadja

And then we have, on the other hand, people who are perhaps a lot more environmentally inclined, but they don't necessarily have this familiarity or the level of comfort with Web3 technologies. So with voice being this carbon neutral NFT platform, I'm really curious to hear your insights on which NFT audience segments the broader Web3 industry is targeting in terms of climate awareness and how can this be scaled to a broader audience? Is step one to get people to care about the environment or is step one to onboard people into Web3? Or is there a way we can kind of do both at the same time?

32:50

Amanda

That's a really great question and it's one that I think about quite often because if we want Web3 to be scaled to a wider audience and mass adopted, we need to make it more accessible. And that goes hand in hand with making sure that the digital future we're building is environmentally responsible. Like you mentioned, the first wave of interest in NFTs was focused on quick gains, overnight success, and this really sexy hype. And it was led by Web3 natives, speculative investors, people who already held cryptocurrency and were bullish on it. These people weren't as concerned with the environmental costs because the personal success potential was at the forefront of their minds. Right, but also maybe we can think of this in a positive light because money talks and the massive amounts of money that people were making is what catapulted NFTs and blockchain talk into mainstream consciousness.

33:51

Amanda

And those stories are what made people pay attention and then also very quickly condemn Blockchain tech for being bad for the environment and consuming massive amounts of energy. There were so many articles that were coming out one after the other that were just like, blockchain is terrible for the environment. Ethereum and Bitcoin are using x amount of energy. That's more than a small country and it turned a lot of people off. But the outcry also really inspired companies to think about how do we harness this tech responsibly? Because the tech is not going anywhere. People love it's all over the place. But how do we get these people on board? Because there is no future of Web3 if we don't expand our audience and if we don't bring more people into the fold. And to do that, we have to be. Better for the environment.

34:57

Amanda

And I think that the audience segments that are currently being targeted for climate awareness, in part they tend to be artists just because NFTs have this association with digital art and artists are typically a pretty socially conscientious group. The second wave of interest in NFTs and Blockchain are people who believe in the ability of NFTs to create financially sustainable model for artists to be compensated fairly and receive royalties for the first time ever. So it's a lot of creative types, but it's also a lot of brands. Like right at the beginning when Blockchain was getting all of this bad press, a lot of brands were hesitant to jump into the NFT space. And a big factor in that was not wanting their name to be associated with something that was terrible for the environment. For example, Voice is currently running a partnership and artist residency program with PhotoVogue, which is a chapter of Vogue Italia, and it's the brand's first foray into Web3 and NFTs.

36:10

Amanda

And a major deciding factor for them in partnering with us with Voice was the fact that we're a carbon neutral company and that carbon neutral Blockchain options exist and it's an easier way for them to step into this Web3 space and it's a way that won't alienate their current audiences. So all that to say that I think the primary audience being targeted for climate awareness can be broken down into two groups, artists and brands. And I think it's through these brand partnerships with companies who are well recognized and have name recognition that are completely outside of the Web3 world that will help us scale this to a broader audience. Because when you onboard someone like PhotoVogue, you're also onboarding their entire audience who may have never engaged with Blockchain or thought about Blockchain aside from the negative headlines that they saw. And now they're hearing from PhotoVogue about how there are climate neutral or even positive solutions and ways to get into this.

37:27

Nadja

Wow, I wish that we had another hour to talk about all of this because I am dying to ask everyone seven more questions. But in the interest of time, I am going to try and control myself. So I would love to leave some room as well for the audience to chime in. So I'm going to do a bit more of a rapid fire session. Round one. Maya, what is the Future of NFTs and how is it going to evolve from what we are seeing and what is happening in the market today?

38:02

Maya

I think that what we're headed toward is more of a focus on attention and engagement instead of ownership, instead of simply the data and the transparency of that which are very important for climate action. I think we're going to find ways to reward and entice people to get involved and use their voices, use their actions. And that can be anything from people writing letters to leaders making social media posts, giving talks to their local communities, or actively engaging in things like cleanups, tree planting events, or other kinds of volunteering. So I think that the shifting of that is going to feel a lot more meaningful for individuals because they will have a role to play. They will not simply be passive, maybe purchasers or maybe people visiting the Metaverse and wandering around and looking at art, but feel like they actually have a way to contribute to climate action.

39:08

Nadja

Brilliant. Thank you. Adrian, what about your Future of NFTs?

39:14

Adrian

This was touched upon by Amanda and others, but user experience is extremely important. It's still a bit of a hindrance, and that needs to be solved. I think it will become more ubiquitous. I think that the environmental factor was a factor, and that is no longer a factor. I was at a Web3 conference the other day, and there was a banker speaking, and they were saying, well, now that Ethereum is on proof of stake, it's actually making it acceptable for ESG investors. So I think we might see the floodgates once that argument is out of the way. The Future of NFTs, specifically too, I think, reside maybe on the emerging generation. Growing up. There's huge differences between how we identify ourselves between generations. I've got young kids, so I'm starting to learn from experience. But we're spending a lot more time online in the digital world.

40:15

Adrian

So that imperative to have an identity, to project an identity to others. Will it go through NFTs? I think so. That's my bet. That's my conviction. And building those digital identities, standing for something is, I think, the Future of NFTs. Obviously, there's a lot to be said about utility and feedback and data in the environment sector and others, but that, to me, is sort of the long arc.

40:51

Nadja

Amanda, you are right in the middle of the NFT scene on the daily. What do you see as the future of this technology?

41:00

Amanda

Yeah, so, I mean, I absolutely loved Adrian and Maya's perspectives on utility and this idea of creating kind of like these online personas, and that's being the future, I approach things from a much more visual, art centric perspective. The future that I want to see involves moving away from the speculative market. I want to see mass adoption of NFTs as a way of supporting the artists that you love, in addition to the things that Maya and Adrian brought up. There are so many ways that we can support musicians. We stream their music, we buy their albums, we go to concerts, and we buy merch. But there just aren't as many ways to traditionally support visual artists. And all of these artists are like culture bearers of our societies. They enrich all of our lives. So much so that's really what I want to see, is mass adoption of NFTs as a means of supporting artists in new ways.

41:59

Amanda

And I truly and honestly believe that blockchain tech absolutely has to be eco conscious for mass adoption and the sustained success of the NFT market. The audience has to grow and for that to happen, we have to make blockchain on the whole more sustainable and accessible.

42:18

Nadja

Thank you, Amanda. Rapid fire. Round two. Adrian, I loved what you said earlier about the user experiences aspect of NFTs and the importance definitely that it's going to carry in future because it really offers this completely different way of engaging different stakeholders, whether that is business and consumer, whether that is artists and fans, or in this case, as today's topic going to go ahead. And maybe Amanda, start with you. We have all of this hype and we've touched on this a little bit in terms of all of these other avenues available to artists now that NFTs have come to the fore. And really this idea that we can onboard people who care about things and not only about the speculative nature of art, for example. But what do you think is hindering this progress or mass adoption for NFTs?

43:27

Amanda

A couple of things that are hindering progress and mass adoption for NFTs that jump to mind immediately. One is the climate impact. Obviously we've been talking about that this whole entire time. But number two, I think that the web3 lingo that we use is really difficult for people who are outside of this space to adopt. And I think that it's unintentionally or maybe a little bit intentionally gatekeeping right. Like early adopters of blockchain tech and NFTs have this really strong sense of community amongst themselves and there's just this intimidation factor associated with a lot of the lingo in this space. But also I think that NFTs and Blockchain, it was really led by discussions surrounding the tech, which is also inaccessible to a lot of people. The focus was so much on the tech and it was really awesome because the tech is really incredible.

44:36

Amanda

But when you think about other things that we engage with in our lives, we don't run around talking about the tech that's behind streaming platforms, we just talk about the utility. And so there's this huge focus on the tech and that's kind of scary to a lot of people and brands. So I think once we move away from talking about the tech so much and maybe changing conversations to talk more about the utility, that will lead to some wider adoption.

45:12

Maya

Perfect.

45:13

Nadja

Thank you, Amanda, and I'm so happy that I could finally hear your answer with all of these crazy technology glitches that are happening on Twitter Spaces today. Maya, I would love to hear from you as well. What do you think is holding back mass adoption and really this more fast paced forward progression in terms of NFTs?

45:34

Maya

Well, I really appreciated Amanda's response and I haven't mentioned it yet, but I wanted to say very clearly that voice is by far my favorite platform. It's where I feel at home, it's where I collaborate with others and I think that's an aspect that I think people are missing too, the sense of community. I mean, everybody who's in Web3 will talk about community as being very high on their list of being a fulfilling part of the whole system. But I think for the outsiders they don't necessarily see that they're not in it and I think that's a really important part to convey. I think the good thing is that we have gone through this big reckoning, right? We've gone past the scams and the hype and the crash and all of that and now we're into a sort of recognition phase where I'm hoping more and more people will recognize the positive qualities of Web3 and how they can positively impact their own lives.

46:33

Maya

Whether it's a sense of community, like I'm just saying, or as an artist, an opportunity to reach more people and to connect with other artists. I think once people see how it can impact their own lives in a positive way, they will be much faster to embrace it. But the main thing is going beyond this idea of individual ownership and gain and wealth to collective good and community.

47:02

Nadja

Adrian, so happy that you can also rejoin us. Apologies for all of the just glitches that couldn't stop happening today. So I'm very happy to have you all three of you back here. What do you reckon Adrian? What is hindering progress or adoption and especially mass adoption for a technology like NFTs?

47:24

Adrian

Yeah, I mean Amanda and Maya covered it really well. So what I might add is this notion of the snowball effect. So there is a critical mass that needs to happen. So we're talking about Ubiquity user experience, changing people's lives and I think it's just going to kind of happen over time in a snowball effect. I'm old enough to remember the late ninety s. I remember being very shocked with my college friends watching TV and all these companies that we've known for a really long time are starting to have these.com addresses after they're on the spot and we didn't really know what it meant. We were doing email, we had AOL, but we didn't really understand. And I think we're not people around this call and sort of can imagine what the future is, but I think none of us can really fully imagine what it is.

48:22

Adrian

But once that snowball effect kicks in and a whole bunch of people see what it can do and new people emerge to create the startups of tomorrow and there are some on this call today, then that should in theory really be quite a significant tipping point, I think.

48:44

Nadja

Thank you all so much. In our final round three sprint of the rapid fire question. We are already overtime, I'm very well aware of this, so I'm going to ask you to really give me that one liner that we can all take away with us. Maya, what is your philosophy about Web3 changing lives?

49:11

Maya

I think really the biggest factor is that it will bring us together. We will share knowledge in common because it will be verified, it will be transparent. That means we'll be on the same page as we move forward. And whether we're talking about climate or community or anything else, we will be coming at it with the same information, and that will make an enormous difference in the products we make in the future. Beautiful.

49:40

Nadja

Adrian, please add on top of this, what is this philosophy that you carry with you about Web3 changing lives?

49:51

Adrian

To me, Web3 is just an idea. It's a very powerful idea. Web3 may not be this decentralized, wonderful place where users are empowered and sustainability is embedded. That's not necessarily the future of the Web3. So web3 is an ideal. It's the ideal I've just described in my mind. So the web is really a battlefront. And we talked about greed and speculation and all those things. Ultimately Web3 and Blockchain, more specifically. It's a tool. It's a really exciting tool. It multiplies the possibilities of what is possible, for example, in the visual arts, as Amanda said, and in the conservation sector, as I've experienced. But ultimately, will humans be attracted only by the greed and the speculation? Will they not really care about being empowered and decentralized, but actually will be fine about big companies like Meta designing the future web? Yeah, that's not 100% certain.

50:55

Adrian

So I see this as sort of a battle and that, you know, I'm trying and a lot of people, especially on this call, definitely are trying to build a future Web, whether it's 3 or 3.5 or 5 that is a good version of humanity and a good version of the world.

51:13

Nadja

Beautiful. Thank you so much. Amanda, what is your philosophy about Web3 and the possibility it has to change lives?

51:23

Amanda

I really agree with Adrian. It is a battle between personal, individual greed and collective good. And I think of Web3 as a vehicle. Right. It's not web3 that's changing lives. It's the people and how they utilize the tools that Web3 gives us and the communities and honestly, my own personal experiences on a daily basis, I am so impressed by the online NFT Web3 communities that I'm in and the amount of focus that is put on giving back. There are so many artists that I know who utilize Voice to raise money for mental health awareness, for LGBT youth, for environmental causes, and I am blown away every day at these Individual Commitments to Positive Change and how people have turned their creativity into these vehicles for good, and how they're utilizing Web3 tech to do that.

52:43

Nadja

Yeah, that's another vote from me for wishing I had 2 hours, but unfortunately, it is already past the end of the first and only hour that we have all agreed to. So, audience, I am not unfortunately going to allow a lot of time for questions because of the above mentioned reason, but I just want to get to at least one or two of them very quickly. So let me quickly see, do you think that technology can progress in a sustainable way or is there always going to be a large carbon footprint? So maybe we can leave on that realistic, hopefully positive note that, yes, there is a yay to this or guest speakers of today. Maya, Adrian, Amanda, what is your opinion? Is it possible that we have a more all rounded, sustainable future ahead of us in terms of technology?

53:44

Adrian

Absolutely. That's the quickest answer.

53:48

Maya

Yes. We have to believe that's what.

53:50

Amanda

We’re all working toward 100%. And I think that we have to continue putting pressure on companies to find more environmentally conscious alternatives. That it's possible. We just saw all of the pressure that people put on ethereum for being so terrible for the environment. Look what they did. They changed their model, they've made movements in a positive direction. So I do think that it's possible, but it requires us to keep the pressure.

54:31

Nadja

Well, this is probably the best answers that you could receive to any question is to simply say yes, despite all of the hurdles, despite all of the battles being fought, in the end we are fighting for something worthwhile, no matter the obstacles, no matter the difficulties. But at some point in the future we will get there, hopefully still within our generation. But if not, we are also someone mentioned earlier about being guardians, but we are really the guardians of not only the planet, but also the future generations in what we are teaching them and what we are showing them. So at some point we will stop needing to have these discussions, no matter how long that's going to take. So, Adrian, Amanda, Maya, wow, it's been an absolute pleasure spending this time with you today and a huge thank you not only for inaugurating the Future of NFTs panel discussion, but also just with bearing with us as Twitter was just glitching without end.

55:41

Nadja

So I love the synergy between what all of you are doing, the different paradigms that you represent in the space. So before I draw the show to a close, I would like to invite you to just very briefly share any final thoughts and maybe something that the audience can take away with them, post this space and then also just let us know where to follow you and the work that you are doing.

56:10

Maya

Sure, I can start. I would just want to say my message that gives me a lot of inspiration is just small is beautiful. Don't be overwhelmed by the task at hand. Look for small ways to participate and contribute and feel that you are engaging and helping others and you can find out more about me and my work on my Linktree. It's linktr.ee/mayafrost.

56:36

Amanda

Yeah. And I'll kick things off on my end or close things up on my end by encouraging you all to explore the artists that we have on Voice. If you just go to Voice.com .Everything that I do is for the purpose of amplifying artists, so you can follow me on the account that I have here. But also, I encourage you all to follow Voice just because we have so much incredibly talented artists on the site and they all deserve love and attention and support.

57:18

Adrian

Yeah, so as you were closing this and asking for remarks, my four year old woke up from her nap and stepped in and she's looking very sleepy, these big wide eyes. And, yeah, the future is bright and it's also extremely important. We talked about the positive aspect, but it is a battle, it is going to be difficult and we're going to be needing to spend a lot of energy into this. So I'm there. You can join me, help me, and counsel me. I'm most active on LinkedIn. Adrian Dellecker. I also have this website, tldr.earth, and I'm always up for these conversations or bilateral conversations to try to make the world a better place.

58:12

Nadja

Lovely, lovely, guys. Thank you so incredibly much. And for those of us who have been here for this entire hour, maybe we need to go take that nap that Adrian's four year old has just woken up from. There's been a lot to digest. But audience, I hope that today's discussion gave you a new perspective on the potential of NFTs for good and also really highlighted this relationship between a topic that's as important, but not really a lot of fun as climate awareness and this really fast moving world of Non Fungible Token technology. And what is possible? What are the possibilities of the future? So, on that note, I will catch you again next week for another episode of The Future of NFTs, brought to you by AdLunam. Cheers, everyone, and to my amazing speakers today, I cannot thank you enough. I definitely need to go listen to this recording now, so I can just relive all of the amazing nuggets of wisdom that was dropped here.

59:14

Nadja

Thank you so much and we'll be following on what every one of you are up to.

59:21

Maya

Thank you.

59:22

Amanda

Thank you, Nadja.